Batman and Robin

Looking at the weather forecast, today seemed the best option for another visit to Cheshire Oaks Fisheries now the ice has melted, but would the carp play?

There was a match there yesterday, pegs 3 and 5 took the top two places so I split the difference on peg 4.

In view of the cold snap I scaled down on the size of maggot feeder


Overhead a kestrel kept watch



Robin kept me company in return for a regular supply of maggots



No one else fishing today,
I only had one bite all day and I didn't hook that!




Spent my time trying to come up with a report title; maybe something to do with a Christmas robin...

Needn't have worried, when I got home postie had been with
Batman!

Very difficult to make a report on fish when nothing happens so well done and a great title.

What would you rather be--a Bat or a Robin ???

VALVEBOUNCE wrote:

What would you rather be--a Bat or a Robin ???

If we are talking cars I'll take the Bat Mobile over the Reliant Robin every time!

Good report and pictures thanks for sharing the session

Notbad wrote:

Looking at the weather forecast, today seemed the best option for another visit to Cheshire Oaks Fisheries now the ice has melted, but would the carp play?

There was a match there yesterday, pegs 3 and 5 took the top two places so I split the difference on peg 4.

In view of the cold snap I scaled down on the size of maggot feeder


Overhead a kestrel kept watch



Robin kept me company in return for a regular supply of maggots




No one else fishing today,
I only had one bite all day and I didn't hook that!




Spent my time trying to come up with a report title; maybe something to do with a Christmas robin...

Needn't have worried, when I got home postie had been with
Batman!

I remember years ago hearing the Dink' 'Dink' of birds pinching my maggots out of the old Aluminium maggot tins.

I'd hoped to fish again the next day so I kept the left over maggots, I sealed the plastic lid of the maggot tin, then to be sure I zipped that inside my canvas bait bucket.

Didn't fish again but next day I found quite a few escapee maggots in my van, fortunately all contained by a boot tray, thing is the maggots were 50/50 white and red, but all the escapees were white, how does that work?

When I was a teenager the only place we could get maggots from was Wolverhampton which was a 10 mile bike ride there and 10 miles back I rode there one Saturday so I could go fishing on the Sunday got my maggots in a tin put them in my saddle bag and rode home when I got home the top had come of the tin and all the maggots were in the bottom of my saddle bag I tried to get them out but only got about half the rest were in the folds of the bag, there were flies coming out of my saddle bag for weeks I kept my bike in the garden shed I went to get it a couple of days later and the shed was full of flies.

I've noticed that red maggots are always a bit dopier than whites.Personally,I put it down to the red dye.
It has been banded about that the red dye in maggots is Carcogenic (?)
Loads of people use dead maggots purposely,they freeze them.
Dead ones can't wriggle into the silt or muddy bottom,and they work just as well.
If I fish with maggots two days on the trot,I use the same maggots,after the second day,after that,if there is any left,I freeze them.
Probably need live maggots in a feeder.

I've been on the internet but can't find anything about maggot doping so to speak, but yes there have been carcinogenic concerns initially with bronzed maggots.

I won't be doing the old thing of warming maggots up by popping them in my mouth!

I think there was something about red food colouring as well, indeed the curry sauce from my preferred Chinese takeaway is not the strong red colour it used to be!

I think only active maggots would work in a maggot feeder,
I did mix in a light sprinkle of 1mm pellets and coolswim groundbait and that washed out from the feeder well enough.



VB you have given me an idea for a scientific ( ish) test but it will have to wait until the next time I go carp fishing.

I think red maggots vary depending on who has dyed them.I've had red maggots with an overpowering smell of chemicals.
I've started using seperate boxes for white and red.Some places I get them from,inside a few hours,mixed,they all turn the same colour.
To stop them sweating, I've thought of using micro pellets instead of sawdust etc in the maggot box.
Looking forward to your scientific experiment results

Hi Guys,
Regarding maggot dyes, especially 'bronze', in the 1980's a chemical called 'Chrysoidine' was used to dye white maggots 'bronze', which left anglers with 'bronze' fingers and no doubt transferred into the 'body' via eating butties etc. This dye was linked to bladder cancer and discussions were held in parliament about the effects to anglers (?) - a prominent top class England match angler at the time died from complications due to a 'cancer' - the angling press blamed Chrysoidine - this chemical was outlawed as a 'maggot dye' but as it was the best for turning white maggots 'bronze' - maggot farms stopped dyeing the maggots and added the chemical to the 'food' that was used to grow the maggots (fish, chicken, offal), thereby no external dye on the maggots to transfer onto anglers fingers (?)
Other colours (red, yellow, fluro etc) all have been banned in Holland and Belgium due to doubts over the safety of long term use of 'dyed' maggots.

I spent 35 years in the fishing tackle trade and have 'riddled' thousands of gallons of maggots over the years and in the early years even used Chrysoidine myself to dye maggots 'bronze' and it had a strange 'smell' a sort of 'acrid ammonia' smell - well, I am still here at 73 (retired) now still building/repairing fishing rods and hope to keep going a lot longer - cheers.
RB

Thanks for the info RB,it's nice to have the facts straight.
Do you know if the maggot farms have changed the size of bluebottes they use? Maggots seemed to be a lot bigger a few years ago.
I was once fishing on Sale Marina,and accidentally (like you do) kicked my maggots over.A guy further up the bank saved the day for me and gave me
some of his maggots,they were nearly twice as big as the ones I had had.
Of course i had to enquire where he got his from.
I can't remember exactly,but it was somewhere between sale and Altrincham.
I always got my maggots from the north side of Manchester,and sometimes from the old guy in Glossop.The old fishing shop that is now "Carp Fever" used to have the best maggots.They don't do maggots now.
I think the guy that had the shop also had the maggot farm near Glossop,beside the reservoirs.I spoke to him a couple of times on an air rifle site,but I can't remember his name(old age,Haha)

Hi Valvebounce,
The size of maggots is determined by (1) what they are fed-on at the maggot farm and (2) how old they are.
(1) Maggots fed on 'fish' are always bigger/fatter because of the water content in the fish.
(2) Older maggots lose 'size' because they shrink as they use up the digested food. Another cause of 'smaller' maggots is the fact that the maggot farm removes them from the 'feed' before they reach the 'mature' size - thus saving money (widespread in the maggot world).

I used all the maggot farms (over the years) in the Greater Manchester area, due to supply problems, erratic quality, price, etc; etc; - it's not surprising that some tackle shops have stopped supplying maggots, as they (maggots) are a right royal pain in the backside to buy, clean and then store them in special fridges (all expense) plus the fact that they 'smell', especially if you are buying 60 gallons a week (as we were at one point).
The popularity in Carp fishing and the use of boilies/pellets helped most shops to cut-down on buying maggots with all the above problems.
RB

Cheers RB,I might have a go at breeding some maggots in the summer using Fish.
My bottom freezer drawer is full of out of date fish (supermarket)
My daughter saves any that goes out of date for me,and the lady next door.
I intend to use it for chum when I go fishing on my boat.
there's at least 7 packs of Salmon fillets.
I've made a couple of,6ft'ish rods up with strong winch fittings for boat fishing.
I used the top sections of old Carp rods.I've got plenty of rods for the boat,but short ones are easier to handle.
VB

Really interesting info Rodbuilder!

VB I'd noticed the maggots seemed smaller than I remembered! Not as small as "squats" but certainly smaller than I recall.

Breeding maggots might not be popular with your neighbours!
In the days when I used to shoot
(mostly woodpigeon over decoys with a 12 bore -but I've owned a good few air rifles too) on hot summer days if you weren't quick to drop a freshly shot bird into a sack you had a maggot farm wriggling away on the carcass by the end of the day and the gamedealer wouldn't accept them.

Hi VB and Not Bad,
Interesting discussion about 'maggots' - taken for granted by most freshwater anglers but quite a complicated subject when you get into it -

Regular maggots (bluebottle host), kept in sawdust or maize meal/flour.
'Pinkies' maggots (greenbottle host), kept in sawdust (must be kept dry or they will 'escape').
'Squats' maggots (housefly host), kept in foundry sand.

If you try to 'breed' your own supply of maggots, you will get a mix of all the above, hence different size of maggots (regular biggest, pinkies smaller, squats smallest).

Also, interesting, I too shoot 'woodies' in the Summer and it does not take long for the 'shot' birds to attract 'flies' in warm weather - only the 'greenbottle' fly will lay eggs on pigeons and in the 1970-80's my older customers would call these 'home-bred' maggots from 'woodies' 'SPECIALS', not in large amounts but highly prized hook baits, especially in matches on the Bridgewater Canal.
Benny Ashurst and his son Kevin won lots of matches using this 'magic bait' (they had a maggot farm, so an obvious advantage).

RB

That is again very interesting Rodbuilder! Given the redfibre packed meat on a woodpigeon's breast I can well imagine that makes for a "rich" flavoured match winning maggot.
You probably remember then that back in the 1970s there was a time when woodies were going for export and the exchange rate was such that gamedealers were paying far more for them than the cost of a cartridge,
so much so that I recall people were giving up jobs in power stations in Nottinghamshire and going  shooting instead!
( Not necessarily with permission )
Then I think it was the Italian Lira that devalued or something and the export trade in them calmed down.

Hi Not bad,
Pigeon shooting,
I personally have not shot loads in a day, probably my average is 12 as I don't like 'breasting-out' more than this as I am busy doing other things (like rod repairs etc) but I enjoy eating them (4 breasts) once a couple of weeks or so, sliced and marinated in garlic puree, soy, tomato puree, chilli paste and eaten with 'spicy Mexican rice' from Sainsburys - hits the spot.

The price given from game dealers (in modern times) for 'woodies is dependent on 'supply and demand' - on a 'glut' year maybe 10 pence a bird and on a 'lean' year 25 pence a bird (?).

I knew of a couple of experienced decoy pigeon shooters who shot over a 1000 one summer and sold them (frozen) to a dealer for £100 after travelling 200 mile round trip, as the market was flooded that year and no other dealer wanted them.

RB

I had permission on a couple of farms near Chester (might still have,not been for ages) it's uncanny how soon flies get on freshly shot rabbits.
Minly used air rifles and subsonic 0.22's with sound moderators.

That's quite some price collapse from the peak Rodbuilder! Maybe not a bad thing in some ways.

Can't say I enjoyed pigeon - too strong a taste for me.

VALVEBOUNCE wrote:

I had permission on a couple of farms near Chester (might still have,not been for ages) it's uncanny how soon flies get on freshly shot rabbits.
Minly used air rifles and subsonic 0.22's with sound moderators.

I used a .22 with subsonic ammo once, it didn't seem much more effective than a decent air rifle, my best one was a non FAC Weihrauch 35 export in .22 with silencer and 50mm scope, terribly heavy but nice to use,
It always surprised me that .20 wasn't more popular, saving that .177 v .22 question.  

Must get back out fishing!

Hi,
Good quality PCP air rifles are certainly very effective, I use a Weihrauch 100 in .177 calibre (12ft lbs) and rabbits and 'tree rats' out to 30 yds (head shots) instant kill.
On the other hand a .22 rimfire with subsonic ammo (90ft lbs) works much better out to 75yds and is almost as quiet as the air rifle - ammo a lot more expensive though!,
RB

I miss the thump in the shoulder but I'm stuck with tinnitus as a constant reminder. Tried field target shooting for a while but it just wasn't the same.

Had hoped to chuck some lead at the fish over High today, it was bucketing it down on the flood though, it's sunny now but too late, well in to the ebb now, forecast for the coming week isn't very promising either.